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The Cornwall Cancer Cafe podcast with Matthew Clarke.
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And welcome to another edition and as often is the case, I have Emma Coombe with me.
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Hello, Matthew. Good morning, I should say. It is morning, just about.
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Just about.
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Thanks to the National Lottery Community Fund for supporting this podcast.
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So we’re in the crypt of St Andrew’s Church in Redruth and we’ve got all sorts of
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things around here. We’ve got a crucifix on the wall, we’ve got a keyboard, we’ve got
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a photocopier, it’s all sorts of things mixed together.
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And we’re going to talk about a very interesting topic to a lot of men this week, aren’t we, Emma?
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Yes, we are. So to summarise before we begin, I walked into the Sunrise Centre
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for an appointment and set eyes on someone I did not expect to see there.
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And this person was going through something and needed it to be private until they were ready to share.
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But I was there for a quick chat and hopefully I was helpful at the time.
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But today we are going to be talking to Father Peter from Redruth, who is going to share his story with us.
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OK, so we’ll meet Father Peter in a moment.
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First of all, I’ve got to tell everyone that this is sponsored or funded rather by the
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National Lottery Community Fund. So thank you very much to them and remind anyone listening
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that we are not medically trained. We are not psychiatrists, counsellors.
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What we are are people with lived experience of cancer.
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So that’s the first thing. Second thing to remember is that everyone is different.
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So you might hear something in this podcast and you think, oh, why aren’t I feeling that?
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Well, everyone is different. Every cancer experience is different and every cancer is different too.
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So don’t feel that you should be feeling something that is mentioned in this podcast.
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Maybe you do, maybe you don’t. Hopefully it’ll be helpful though.
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And the third thing to say is this is a big hug to everyone who is going through the mill at the moment.
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So Emma, I think it’s time that you introduced Father Peter to us.
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So I’ve known Father Peter for a very, very long time.
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20 years.
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I play saxophone. I don’t know whether we’ve mentioned that before in any of our podcasts, but I play…
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I think we did. We have, yes.
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But wait, there’s no point not sort of going into it again. You play saxophone, don’t you?
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I play the saxophone. I play the saxophone. I play it in a big band.
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And our band has been rehearsing at Christchurch in Lana where Father Peter officiates.
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Is that the correct word?
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Yeah, I’m sort of…
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Well, 20 years ago, I was the priest in charge of Christchurch in Lana and the church in Four Lanes.
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And I retired early 14 years ago, but the bishop said to me, just carry on working.
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So I do. So I’m still linked with Christchurch where the band plays.
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So through that, I’ve met Father Peter many, many times and I think we’re friends now.
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We’re brother and sister because of this.
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We are. You call me your sunrise sister now, don’t you?
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Yeah. I’ll tell you how it all happened.
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About two years ago, someone in one of my congregations told me they had prostate cancer.
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And we got a big fundraising evening for them and Prostate Cancer UK.
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And a result of that, lots of publicity material was left in the church,
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which I used to walk past and think, oh, I’m glad I haven’t got it.
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And then one day I walked past it and I thought, perhaps I’d better take a test.
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And it was a sort of time when really high profile people were coming out in the media
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and saying they got prostate cancer.
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So anyway, I took the test and all hell broke loose because my count was too high.
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They discovered through a scan that the cancer was on the edge of the prostate.
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So it was a danger it would break through.
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It was at grade three.
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And they said, you’ve got to have surgery and you’ve got to have radiotherapy.
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So you just better get on with that.
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So I was sent to a series of consultations with people.
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And they decided that they would not remove the prostate,
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but they’ll do what’s called a TORP, which is where they drill a hole in it.
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And then about two weeks after the surgery, then you go for radiotherapy.
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So part of the process before the therapy was going to a bone scan.
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And at this stage, nobody knew.
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I didn’t tell anybody, not my family, not my best friend in the world.
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Nobody knew.
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And so off I go to do the bone scan.
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And the clerk at the bone scan department in Trilisk was someone I knew very well
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from my work in a primary school.
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And I thought, oh, now it will be around the whole village.
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And she was looking down at her papers.
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And when she looked up, she just looked at me and said, name.
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And then I just told her my name.
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And this is someone I knew really well.
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She wrote all the details down.
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And at the end, she just said, no one will know from me.
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And that was overwhelming.
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It’s overwhelming now just to tell you.
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And she never told a soul.
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And I used to see her in the local quiz.
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She never told anybody.
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So the journey goes on.
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Surgery was done.
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I had to have a catheter, which I called Clarence Clearwater.
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And so I’d be at the altar with my catechon.
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And under it would be Clarence Clearwater.
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And then it was radiotherapy.
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And they said, oh, you’ll have to have 20 sessions.
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I said, I can’t possibly.
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My diary will not sustain 20 sessions.
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And they said, well, you could join a project where we can do it in five.
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That will do, I said, five.
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And they said, and you’ll have to go on hormone therapy for years.
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OK.
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So I now will do a publicity stunt for the Sunrise Center.
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The Sunrise Center had an enormous impact on me because of the kindness,
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the respect, the compassion, the understanding that that center gave to me.
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Because I went there all afraid.
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And what was going to happen?
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Would a beam suddenly surround me?
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And would I be burnt up?
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But they were just wonderful.
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And at the end of the five sessions, I said to them, what can I do?
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Can I raise money for you?
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And they said, you can raise money if you want to.
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But what you can do is to tell people to take the test.
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So I knew then I had to go public.
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So I wrote a statement which was sent out to all of my churches,
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the six churches I work in, telling them what had happened
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and how I’d been treated and how wonderful the Sunrise Center was.
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And a group of us are now launching a £10,000 appeal for the Sunrise Center,
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which comes to fruition in June, on June the 20th in the Penventon Hotel.
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And our target is £10,000 for the sunrise.
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And I’ll tell you one little thing about the sunrise.
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I said to the radiographer one day, I said,
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have I got this because I’m gay?
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And he said, no, you’ve got it because you’re old.
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I have to say, Emma, listening to Father Peter there,
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what he mentions is the kindness and the compassion in the Sunrise Center.
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I found it in the Cove and in the Hematology and the Headlands Unit.
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And the amount of compassion and kindness.
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I think you’re just enveloped in it, aren’t you, Father?
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I just can’t speak too highly of them.
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There was this moment each time when they say,
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it’s trousers off, it’s pants off,
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and immediately my underwear was coming down.
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There was this nurse who slapped a tissue over my bits
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so I wouldn’t be embarrassed.
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And just that little gesture showed the love and compassion that they have.
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And I said to one of the managers one day,
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how do you choose such wonderful staff?
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And she said, when we interview, we just know.
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We just know who will fit in here.
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So it’s just the most wonderful place.
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And you should just never be afraid to go there
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because you think you’re the only one,
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and you know there’s a great queue behind you,
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but you are the only one at that moment when the beam is surrounding you.
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Can I ask what place does faith have in how you deal with everything that’s going on?
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I tell people, in fact I was telling them only yesterday
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when we did a fundraising event for Parkinson’s,
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that whatever darkness surrounds you,
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the light of God’s love surrounds you
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if you allow it to shatter the darkness
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and remember that the light is with you
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and you do not face anything alone
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because our faith tells us that Jesus had suffered himself on the cross,
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that the light suffers for you
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and you just have to remember that he is with you
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and you are not alone.
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And even if you don’t go to church
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and even if you don’t think you’ve got a strong faith
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or even if you’ve got no faith at all,
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I will believe for you that the light surrounds you
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and you need not be afraid. Amen.
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Thank you very much for that.
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Emma, thoughts?
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Thoughts?
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Well, shall we go back to the Sunrise Centre?
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What a place!
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I know, it’s amazing, isn’t it?
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But the day that I walked in and you were sat there
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and you went, oh, I haven’t told anybody yet,
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please don’t say anything.
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And then about ten minutes later somebody else walked in
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and came and sat with you
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and it was another family who were also,
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a member of the family was in there for treatment
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and you had a similar conversation.
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But everybody kept your confidence.
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Everyone, everyone.
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Until you were ready to share your news.
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And now everybody knows
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because it’s not a secret anymore.
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And I say to any group that I might be talking to about it,
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the men must take the test.
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Do not leave it too late.
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Mine was almost too late
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because I kept walking past the publicity material
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and thinking I hadn’t got it.
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You may have no symptoms at all, but take the test.
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Don’t wait. Take it.
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Do you feel that there is a really strong place these days
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always for open and honest conversation
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and approaching cancer, all types of cancer
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and discussion about it?
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Because some people are very afraid of talking about it.
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You even have people not wanting to say the word cancer.
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My father died of cancer.
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And my mother kept saying,
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don’t tell anybody, don’t tell anybody,
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as if it was something like the plague
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that was catching if you touch someone who had cancer.
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My beloved friend, who I was with for 31 years,
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he died of a blood cancer.
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And he didn’t want anyone to know
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because he felt embarrassed and a bit awkward.
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But that was 11 years ago that he died.
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But now there’s nothing wrong.
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No one is afraid anymore.
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You must not be afraid of the word.
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The word has such overtones,
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but we can take the fear away from the word by using it,
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by telling people, oh, yeah, I’ve got it.
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I’ve met so many prostate cancer brothers
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since I came out with it.
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And we greet each other in the street
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and we greet each other in social meetings.
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And it’s very supportive to know that you are not alone
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and people will now talk about it quite openly.
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And Emma’s my cancer sister.
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And there’s other people who we surround each other.
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We fall into each other’s arms whenever we meet
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because that’s how it is.
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I think we’ve mentioned before that cancer is the club
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that Noel wants to be a member of.
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Once you’re in it, you’re in it.
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That is a thing that we can all support each other.
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There is a lot of support out there.
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And that’s the whole point of this podcast,
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to give that support and other projects.
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The Cove, I can’t speak highly enough myself
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because of that support.
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My youth group, years and years ago,
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when the Cove was first being built,
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my youth group, which had about 30 children in it,
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came to me and said,
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my granny’s got cancer and my mummy’s got cancer.
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Can we do something for the Cove?
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So we raised thousands of pounds for the Cove
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as it was being built
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because people had real experiences
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and wanted to support this place.
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The children wanted to support their loved ones.
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The families wanted to support the children.
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And it was quite amazing how much money
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people were throwing at us for the Cove.
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And it’s just a lovely place to go in.
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If you’re feeling worried before you go into the sunrise
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or the mermaid or the headland
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or wherever you’ve got to go,
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go and sit in the Cove.
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And there’s people there to talk to
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and there’s things to read.
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Or you can just sit on your own.
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And when you come out after treatment,
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if you don’t want to go straight home
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because you’ve been surrounded by all these people
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and you may just want to sit and think and be quiet
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and go in the Cove.
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It’s an amazing, beautiful place
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right next to the sunrise.
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We’ve talked about being a man,
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having prostate cancer, your brothers.
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And now we’ve been talking about the Cove.
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One of the things I’ve found is that
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it is difficult to get men involved in support
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and getting them to take up the support
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opportunities available.
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There is now a group called Cancer,
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which I think is a great one,
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to get men involved.
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I know they started doing a hope course for men as well
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and a look-good, feel-better course for men.
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To get men more involved in taking on the support
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which is available to them.
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We all have different needs.
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My big problem with the treatment I’ve had,
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and I don’t know if there’s a support group for it,
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but I think anyone who’s on hormone tablets
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would experience impotence.
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Now, when I’ve said to the people who phone me up
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to see how I am from the Sunrise Centre
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or from the research project,
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we talk about this, this impotence,
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and they say to me,
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well, there is help available.
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You could have this device or this contraption
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or you could take these pills.
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I don’t feel inclined to accept that sort of support
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because when my beloved friend died,
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just about two weeks before he died,
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we discussed whether I would ever meet someone else.
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And I said, no, there’ll never be anyone else.
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And he said, I think there will be.
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There’ll be George upstairs within a month of my death.
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There won’t be, but now I know there can’t be.
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I can no longer have
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a full relationship with another man.
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And although I might wish to,
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that is now impossible.
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I don’t want to, but now I know I can’t.
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And I find that the worst thing of all.
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I mean, there are other side effects from hormone.
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I cry most of the time when I’m driving along.
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My emotions are heightened,
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and I’m reliving all sorts of things
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that I thought I’d forgotten about.
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But the impotence is the biggest problem.
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I want to come in here, Father Peter,
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because through all my treatment
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for non-Hodgkin’s lymphoma,
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which is a blood cancer.
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That’s what Freddie had, my friend.
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Yeah, so I’ve had two relapses,
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four types of treatment over four years.
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And all that treatment has basically
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completely killed my libido.
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I don’t have…
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Oh, I’ve still got the libido.
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I just can’t do anything about it.
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Well, I haven’t got anything.
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So I completely, you know,
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I’m in that club with you there.
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That’s not a good club to be in.
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None of these clubs are brilliant clubs to be in,
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are they?
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No, we’ve talked about this, haven’t we?
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Off camera, if you know what I mean.
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But I think having the diagnosis in the first place
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absolutely wallops you sideways,
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to begin with anyway,
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and getting used to using the C word, cancer,
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understanding what your treatment’s going to be,
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going through the treatments.
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For me, as well as I’m sure other people,
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you sort of…
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Other things like libido and stuff
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just takes a sideways seat.
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But also talking to other friends out there,
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it’s not unusual.
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No, and the other,
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I mean, some of the other men I’ve talked to,
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we just say we are no longer a man
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and everybody knows what we’re talking about.
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I mean, there are other side effects from hormone therapy
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like you put weight on
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or the hair on my legs has gone.
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Man boobs, man boobs.
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No, I haven’t got them yet.
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Really?
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No, I haven’t got them yet, but maybe I will.
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But in the end, I’m alive.
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Yes.
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In the end, I’m still doing my work.
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In the end, I might have to go to the loo
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more often than usual.
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With Clarence?
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No, Clarence Clearwater is out.
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Clarence Clearwater was the catheter.
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Oh, OK.
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So all those are a small price to pay
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for the fact that I’m still where I want to be,
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still with the people who are precious to me,
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who have trusted me with all sorts of things in their lives.
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And it’s all a small price to pay.
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How does what you’ve been through
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change your perspective and priorities in life?
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I don’t know that it has.
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It’s made me appreciate kindness
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and understanding more, perhaps,
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from people who don’t know me from a hole in the ground.
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It’s made me more trusting, perhaps,
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that people won’t gossip about,
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oh, he’s got it.
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I suppose it’s made me more committed
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to the work I do as a priest
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because I think I can feel more deeply
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the traumas that other people might be going through,
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like I’m visiting someone at the moment in Trilisk
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who’s been diagnosed with two types of cancer.
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And we just sit and hold hands for a long time,
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and I bless her and ask God’s healing arms to surround her.
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And she knows about my friend who died,
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and I know about relatives she’s lost.
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And we’re just together, and that’s what has to happen.
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You just have to be together with people who are struggling
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and not maybe think too much of yourself
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or what other things you could be doing.
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The moment, the time you share with other people
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is now, perhaps, more precious.
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That is actually a really important tip to people
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for supporting someone else through cancer
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or any other critical illness.
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So let’s look at that as one tip.
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Have you got any other tips to people
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to approach people who might be going through it?
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00:22:42.580 –> 00:22:44.820
I think you have to be very honest
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about how you’re feeling and help them to be…
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I mean, if somebody comes up to me and says,
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I’ve just been diagnosed with whatever cancer,
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then it’s no good saying,
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I know just how you feel because you don’t.
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You’ve got to enable them to talk.
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And they might talk all the way around the subject
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until they can actually express what they’ve got
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and how they feel.
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00:23:13.220 –> 00:23:18.980
And then if they ask you what it’s like at the Sunrise Centre
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00:23:18.980 –> 00:23:23.360
or what it’s like to have surgery for a particular cancer,
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then you are able to use your own experience
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to explain what happened to you.
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And maybe in explaining, you take away their fear
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00:23:33.800 –> 00:23:36.300
because they know you’ve been through it.
401
00:23:36.580 –> 00:23:40.560
And give them time to get used to the idea
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00:23:40.560 –> 00:23:42.840
and help them just to understand
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00:23:42.840 –> 00:23:46.280
it is not a death sentence anymore
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00:23:46.280 –> 00:23:48.960
like it was years and years ago.
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00:23:49.200 –> 00:23:52.540
It’s now a thing to be either lived with
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00:23:52.540 –> 00:23:54.220
or cured completely,
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00:23:54.220 –> 00:23:57.160
but it doesn’t mean it’s the end of the line.
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00:23:57.280 –> 00:24:00.280
And you have to take that fear away from people
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00:24:00.280 –> 00:24:02.740
because the treatments now are so wonderful
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that there’s hope.
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00:24:04.500 –> 00:24:06.440
All the time there is hope.
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00:24:06.780 –> 00:24:09.080
And people don’t give up on you
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in the clinical situations.
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00:24:11.980 –> 00:24:15.020
They’re always trying to find the next step
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00:24:15.020 –> 00:24:16.100
to make you better,
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00:24:16.600 –> 00:24:19.700
or to make you live with it more completely.
417
00:24:20.120 –> 00:24:21.880
Thank you very much, Father Peter.
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00:24:22.780 –> 00:24:25.920
So, Emma, we’re coming to the end of this week’s podcast,
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listening to Father Peter.
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00:24:27.600 –> 00:24:30.720
They’re giving some really great words of hope there
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for anyone experiencing this.
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What is your takeaway?
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I knew that Father Peter would be very good with words,
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but also would be able to offer so much of himself.
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00:24:46.480 –> 00:24:47.600
Hope, the word hope.
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00:24:47.700 –> 00:24:48.920
You keep using the word hope.
427
00:24:49.260 –> 00:24:51.940
I think that’s what this podcast needs to be called, Hope.
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00:24:52.540 –> 00:24:54.540
This is maybe not relevant to cancer,
429
00:24:54.540 –> 00:24:56.220
but it is relevant to hope.
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00:24:56.980 –> 00:24:59.740
In Auschwitz, a young woman,
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before she died,
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00:25:02.400 –> 00:25:06.620
wrote on the walls of the cell that she was in,
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00:25:06.620 –> 00:25:10.620
You may not be able to see God, but he’s there.
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00:25:11.020 –> 00:25:15.640
You may not be able to hear God, but he hears you.
435
00:25:16.020 –> 00:25:20.180
You may not be able to see the sun, but the sun is there.
436
00:25:20.420 –> 00:25:22.700
So never lose hope,
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00:25:23.600 –> 00:25:26.740
because hope will bring you life forever.
438
00:25:27.180 –> 00:25:28.960
Thank you very much, Father Peter.
439
00:25:29.740 –> 00:25:33.700
So that’s this week’s program done.
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00:25:33.700 –> 00:25:35.740
We’ll be back next week.
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00:25:35.740 –> 00:25:37.260
Emma and myself.
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00:25:38.160 –> 00:25:40.800
So just make sure you go to the website,
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www.cancercafepodcast.org.
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00:25:47.240 –> 00:25:49.520
You can find us on social media as well,
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00:25:49.520 –> 00:25:51.280
on Facebook and on TikTok.
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00:25:51.760 –> 00:25:56.660
And you can also find the podcast on Spotify
447
00:25:56.660 –> 00:25:58.540
and Apple Podcasts.
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00:25:58.920 –> 00:26:01.700
So why not share it with someone else
449
00:26:01.700 –> 00:26:05.400
who might find this useful to listen to.
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So thank you very much, Father Peter.
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And thank you for even doing this podcast.
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I didn’t know what a podcast was.
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And thank you, Emma.
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See you all next week.
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Thanks to the National Lottery Community Fund
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00:26:27.820 –> 00:26:29.760
for supporting this podcast.